Jul 16, 2013|
We discuss where the Patriots go from here after massive changes (planned and unplanned) this off-season.
We check in with Herm Edwards on the Pats, Stevan Ridley, and a great many things around the NFL.
We stir up a pot of crap when we debate the world cup and the popularity of soccer... pro callers, con-callers, plus Jack Edwards!
We tackle four topics at 4PM.
We preview Pats and Browns and touch on other NFL topics with ESPN's Chris Mortensen.
Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)
Ten days from this moment Michael ten days from this moment. Will be sitting in the sun. Yes. But not on vacation no will be sitting together in the sun -- Not like that I chaise lounge okay aren't just on opposite sides of attain our navy in the same side of the table. Got to drink I'll give you monitoring what my drink and for this for what moment what a huge break it out Biden. Revealing what argue drinking Gatorade one of beer regularly Gatorade. Gatorade. And not July 26 sit outside for ten to six. Hanging out yeah yeah drinkers are very rule against out of the -- I have a personal role against the -- to a before. A rocket to -- and one time one time your draconian no I didn't say that and I and I drink on you were drinking on the one time and it and it should not happen again it was actually listen to it was like yeah I wasn't Palestinian. Interest not a lot. Like to appear to there -- enough story they'll nother awarded one. From. Yes more than one I want her to. Electors are being honored that I'd like I'd like you know I would not know if you heard that you would not of liked it it was not good at all I don't know of the tape I've -- humor I think I've burned all battle remaining -- -- that no -- -- -- -- free you would think that we're. You -- witness a caught enough you would think that but it actually was not nearly as good as you would think it -- that unfortunately out of your smoker I've not done that on there now and I haven't haven't -- that it's just unfortunately you. -- -- we get your high school tapes that your mom's gonna bring back or you're a college states rather tomorrow and on -- got to find it got a farm I know. I don't know my mom that witnessed that where somewhere in the basement. Ten days from right now we will be -- Foxborough for day one of patriots training camp. And we will be talking to you about what we've already witnessed from the first practice 9 AM that morning were ten days away from football. We're ten days away from starting watching football and raised here it is because there's been so much going on I mean. We barely had time to focus on the Red Sox who have the best record in the American League -- and by the way more wins than they've ever had at the all star break in the history the French. More wins than they've ever had a -- all star break in the history of the franchise. This year we barely had time to give them singular focus because there's been so much else going on between Hernandez. And the copper on the and the demolition of the Celtics as we know I mean at that there's been so much. Teachers season starts in ten days. At least in terms of training camp and the beginning in the lead up into September and ultimately get this team often running in and figuring out what the 2013 version looks like. All I ask you this question. Today I think there's a lot of room for patriots aren't a Stewart on the broad question to get us -- -- If the NFL game is all about evolve. All about staying in front staying in front of the pack reacting to what everyone else is doing org or making them react to what you were doing right. The patriots continue to -- ball what's the next step in the evolution of the New England Patriots on the field. So the next that what -- the next thing they do yeah and if you if you you've traced a lot of what the patriots have done and aren't off the field during the Belichick era. And it's -- they are not the same team today but they were in 2001. Right. Yeah OK yeah and in some ways they they have changed. The office has evolved. If you talk about it we just look at that the coordinators on offense they've gone up from from Charlie Weis to Josh McDaniels. To Billy O'Brien. Back to Josh McDaniels again so every time they've had a coordinator changed. They've tweaked it a bit defensively we know going from Romeo and noted that Eric Mangini and Dean Pees. And everybody's had a different week. So and I you know the running backs have changed over the years the receivers have changed over the years. But. Go too crazy with evolution with the patriots. The way I see it they have a ball to good word but has it been dramatic when you still have the principal characters are the principal characters changed. So your head coach. Your quarterback. And your you're your -- -- And maybe -- we -- go do we do we get into the nitty gritty and inside football little bit and look at the front office on the -- No -- Belichick lieutenant no I don't mean right -- I think that they did. There's a lot of different ways you can take the question as I said it's very open ended but it's a good question three most important people in any franchise -- the owner the head coach -- the quarterback they've been does three things every main standards however but they have -- -- they have all those guys eventually write about it. The guys at the same as they work 1213 years and automatic as Japan. Do you think the Tom Brady it's been dramatic candidate Tom Brady that was thrown the ball in in the first Super Bowl season is not the same guy that is playing at this age today. He's bigger stronger throws the ball deeper down the field -- harder smarter he he understands that understands the game better he's making wide receivers better instead of what I think at times appeared to be more the other way around he seems to look down on the field much more often although. His ability to throw the short passes is still right there. Her body was ever you know. Every. I can't I can't imagine what what receiver made Tom Brady. -- think there was ever a guy who is. Who who is receivers made him look good about time we get to -- monsters are established. Yes let our web speaking you know Wes Welker Randy Moss. Tom Brady was it was six years and 67 years and at that point so I can't really think of a guy who made him look better than he actually -- I guess more -- -- -- is the belief that he was a game manager early in his career and that he's grown into being the elite franchise quarterback change -- is still working on its top 32 quarterbacks in the league in Brady's going to be somewhere in the top five and in the -- at seven today was was Ben Roethlisberger so you can kind of do the math and figure out a couple of guys that are left. I think he's pretty universally believed to be in the top four. -- for many not everyone's gonna have the exact same list. But some combination of Brady Manning -- Rodgers and Brees I think are fairly standard for the top four in the NFL today and so. Nobody was thinking about him that way a decade ago. Even even if he was at that point starting to drift into that territory because you Steve stop fighting this image of being a game -- nobody thinks of -- that way anymore. He's not a game manager anymore he's everything I mean he's he's the prototypical NFL quarter. I think he just had two seasons of that season while I guess two seasons because there was the first year. Weary hearing he took over for Bledsoe and then in 2002 despite. There's like 28 touchdown -- -- is that year. He still had to fight the -- and throw the deep ball well the team didn't make the playoff they won nine games. So I am following the Super Bowl win so you know how could really. Is is this guy and how good you know how could Kenny being. Only two years by 0304. Yeah if you if you weren't put in Tom Brady in the elite quarterback class you're missing something. If you weren't doing it buys. Thirsty and yet I mean I think if you were to talk to patriots players and and you certainly did you around the team at the time. A lot of it was we don't get enough respect it's all about Peyton Manning and everybody's pushing. -- Manning or McNair in and that's the type of quarterback that they give more respect to. And because Brady's not putting up the numbers he's just finding ways to win games laid or org they still view him as something less than because -- -- a lot of screens or wide receiver screens or whatever. He's evolved and and and without getting just into the past. To start bringing it into the future how does he continued to evolve because as he gets older he's not getting any more athletic. The league itself seems to be getting more athletic speed of a quarterback running ability in the quarterback all of those things. Seemed to be rising in importance in the NFL and Brady's going in the opposite direction -- doesn't mean that he's going to be -- quarterback. But how does he evolve out of the patriots evolved in order to deal with the all the other things that are going on in the NFL today. You know they don't think they have to right now they may have to win Tom Brady's no longer playing and at that position. Because the question is is that -- does that position. There's that position changed. And they got guys like. Cam Newton guys like Russell Wilson. Colin Capra and thank Andrew Luck. And Robert Griffin the third all these guys become the standard for what you have to do to be a quarterback worth it just a coincidence that this is happening right now. And you can still have a Tom Brady and a patent which of -- the next Peyton Manning if you the next Tom Brady. Five years not ten years from now. They come to a league in and general managers say I'm sorry did. We just don't play that way anymore there's no there's no place -- always be -- place in the league for that type of quarterback. -- -- I'm actually happened while I don't believe they have to adjust to anything right now because they've got one of those record with a hole on the wheel and doesn't just have to be offensively could be the defense of late -- they gonna have to adapt. Defense everybody what's going I think everybody in the -- gas. Because. What what what no matter what your system has played 34 player for three. Pretty much unless you just wanna get hosted and roasted. You're going to be playing a lot of sub defense is just to keep up with -- of the multiple receiver sets the the backs who are are very good catch the ball on the back field got tons of those unity. We saw one and AFC championship games in the last few years rate right. Up. Frank Gore guys who can who can run it and catch it and cannot do a lot of damage. So just go to match of the -- athletic tight ends and three receivers on the field three and four receivers in the field yeah. I think you have to no matter what you say you are no matter what defense you teach out of you going to be going to be. Adapting to what the offenses are doing I think most people do that already. Yeah most most men and yet some of the ways they're doing in has has surprised people mean a couple years ago. We saw a few different teams go towards the really big cornerbacks. And in a league that was had been going smaller and faster at the cornerback position trying to adapt to although all the offense is out there that world to have you wide receivers with and -- -- and every direction. Elvis is if a few coaches just are -- screw this. I'm not gonna keep trying to keep up with these guys of my cornerbacks and it's gonna knock them off their stride. It's funny the patriots used to be that team specifically or anything back and Ty Law jamming receivers at the line of scrimmage and and play and you know coverage down the field. Do they still do that as well as they did they still have the sort of size necessary or is that part of the evolution. Of what the patriots are trying to -- And it just part of our lucky in the first half a -- that you're doing and are given a final football in the air not gonna tell out of jail about the line of scrimmage. That was a little too much for the -- as walking and chewing -- summit. Patriots quarterbacks -- got better in the second half but I'd still think they were they were advanced enough. To be able to do that kind of stuff apparently has changed so you can jam to it agreeing. But he can't do it like the patriots were in 2001 against the rams in Super Bowl or what they did 2003. Vs the colts and -- -- champion you know it's funny we say that we now sort of take that as fact right after what happened against the colts will settle for. The game changed and nobody was gonna allow you to keep doing that anymore during 03 as you can and -- I can afford Bryant but I. Italian man and an analyst wanna bring the Seahawks experience from the last couple years until I watch that team the last couple years. They do that doctor they absolutely do that to a degree that I mean -- -- they put two jagged did you watch that playoff game. Between the Seahawks and and the Redskins roster would you wanna take anything out of last year's playoffs and try to think about how Bill Belichick could use it to his advantage. Take Brandon Browner. For growing Santana Moss all over the field without them. -- I mean literally has them and he's tossing them all over the field like a rag doll cornerback on wide receiver crime. And the refs are like you're good. -- and I know what I know the colts got some of the rules changed. At some of them seem to have been relaxed a little bit in the last couple years they seem to be allowing them because they've taken away the ability of the safety to come across the middle pop -- When you know outlook in the hole you know the quarter ended wide receiver who's who's helpless. It seems like not a lot of got back some other option here. No they're guise of -- -- I know that it's been successful for that they have won anything yet know it's been successful foreign. They have big corners. And they try to beat you up at the line of scrimmage that's a good news and and and even more good news for Seattle is that. Their system. Really is is tailor made for those guys you know they may play a lot of a lot of man. And interview room. And double moves and those guys those big guys. Ball -- -- NN -- they're not alone in this -- Francisco's regularly some of the same zero votes right I mean you've seen a few teams do this I don't wanna make the Seattle specific because there -- a lot of teams that are that are starting to move in that direction. With some of the bigger corners and there are ways to take advantage but its interest thing. I think you can win almost anywhere you want to in the NFL. I really do I think if you have the right players and dedication to your system you can win with any number styles you can be Norv Turner. Throwing the ball deeper down the field large chunks you can be Charlie -- with lots of screen passes you can be running the football -- no more not primarily like 75% of the time but you -- win by running you can win by passing you can -- with a 43 or 34 -- its owner -- man big receiver smaller smaller whenever. As long as you're doing it your way in and I think you're out in front of -- The question is what else in the patriot borrow from what else is going on to have -- -- argue they have put your -- It's -- me to answer your your own question out of the patriots evolve due gateway what's the next step in evolution out of all what do you think it. I don't know I don't know what they need to do to evolve I mean I think that that that I want them to be on the forefront I think it team is best when they are. Forcing other teams to react to them as opposed to reacting to what the rest of the league does. That being said. I'll admit to a little bit of an iron and I wonder whether other patriots fans are there too when you guys can jump in this 6177797937. Ultimate to a little bit of I don't know the word is jealousy or concern not -- for the other two the other teams that have the young dual threat quarterbacks. That that's where the league is going that there is that there is. Personal it's fun to watch but that it provides a whole another. Safe way of doing things when everything else isn't working tournament. Right so if if they're not if if a big corner has taken away. Your receivers. These dual threat quarterbacks can make plays happen right where that -- that go one script yeah. I think that the play was designed this way but they have so much athletic ability and they just make plays happen with their leg. That's one and I think you get that from guys even like Andrew locker Aaron Rodgers guys who wore running the the zone read option. But the other is hey you know what -- win throughout the game what we're doing what we've game plan isn't working we've got another trick in our bag. They can take advantage. Of the defensive -- are being over aggressive when you watch the teams Washington Seattle San Francisco etc. even even to a lesser extent Carolina. One of the cool things I think about the bringing the zone read into the NFL. Is they're taking advantage of the best defense of player on the team usually the best defenders are the are the outside linebackers Indians ranked rushing the passer the whole double blind side topic. Of those guys being great outwardly injured right and one of the Atlantic today. Gets Iraq's prime in their money it is based on their ability gets -- the zone read it uses their aggressiveness against. A really. You wanna come charging barreling right in towards the quarterback on. I'll turn around run around the edge of view take you out of the -- use your aggressive against you aggressiveness. Against you and then I can throw on the run I can run myself I can give it to to the running back and I inside handoff. It it's it's using. Some of the best concepts in football against those. Players OK but what that -- A few things here one thing that will never you never go wrong with this as a football team. In life. Can you -- big picture here you -- big this seems really big or -- OK this is universal got bigger. One thing that will never desert you corporate -- -- is your brain using your brain in the right ways so. If you're talking about these athletic quarterbacks who can do all these things and don't read guys. The Super Bowl winners. The last few years. Quarterbacks apologize predicting clothes. But it was Joseph Flacco he's not one of those guys. -- the year before it was Eli Manning. -- -- the year before that it was Aaron Rodgers. You're before that I think was Ben Roethlisberger. Oh. You get an audit and you know these got. These are these are still you or Ben Roethlisberger probably breaks the mold a little bit I don't think he is as. He's not asleep at those other guys but he does make a lot of plays extend the. He doesn't and Rodgers makes a lot of plays after the play by accident I don't think there is a new breed would you say Aaron Rodgers as their new breed. I think a lot of -- Roger I think he's he's closer to -- I think he Drew Brees or little well I feel like. It's part of the evolution process for a long time it's drop back passers and then all of a sudden you see -- Drew Brees can do when he can move around just a little bit. And you see what Aaron Rodgers can do he can move around just a little bit more and now Andrew Luck may be the perfect quarterback for ever mean he's so big and physical is like Ben Roethlisberger but -- more speed -- I don't think I don't think -- that there will ever be a template for this is what it is now this is what the quarterback going to be. And so I guess that's why I hope there isn't an and I love that you had different options and different to Asia and things everywhere every week what we're seen worsening. Come to the table Russell Russell Wilson content to the table. Andrew Luck and Colin -- clinic in all these other guys come to the table because we've got a lot -- we've got a lot of the traditional guys here. We've got the guys who were in between like -- -- in Ben Roethlisberger. Really seen. Seen this -- a long time them -- -- read option we haven't seen this in the NFL. So that is that is welcome. As well and yet I love that man I love watching every option as long as you got a quarterback who understands his importance and that seemed to be RG three's problem last year. It's -- just refused to get out of bounds. Capita on a couple of occasions less of an issue than RG three to dude you're still the quarterback it's fun watching you run around and he is unbelievably fast. That explosive second gear he has is -- You gotta get out about you cannot take the number of hits and RG three -- be successful but can't predict -- Wilson didn't do that. Mean those guys were getting popped every time they ran the read option there or get out of bounds they were sliding they were just finding ways to not get hit hard and so. I feel like it's it's the very least sustainable. For those still to the patriots not the pitchers aren't going to have any of that. Tom -- not going to do that. Is that a role for Tim Tebow ought to come in and use the read option I don't see it because now you're taken Tom Brady off the field. But how do you expect the patriots to evolve going forward 61777979837. Phone lines nearly full -- -- -- -- rockaholic W -- Say that there's no Rob Gronkowski right so no wrong no Hernandez no -- we just -- you gave -- eleven wins does that speak more your belief in some Brady or Bill Belichick -- both I mean when you add these two -- -- guys together but we you know will we leave out is there there they do have some other players were banning human Dolan because he hasn't been -- We kind of count him out but here's a play. Here's a guy a player who if he stays healthy I think he could be significant in that offense. And then Donald Jones -- got a picked up marine out of the backfield and you -- give low credit to Josh McDaniels as well. He's been able to steal in switched does your game plan to give me on his person of the picture so really for the cadets that. Former pitcher Willie -- on NFL network last night pick in the pats go eleven and five corporation and all those good things like not thirteen -- very today I think about just ridiculous. Danny Amendola can be better than you expect. Jones from buffalo I think he's also allowing for the fact you don't have gronkowski don't have Hernandez you don't have. Wes Welker things have changed the defense still isn't perfect and I think he's. He's saying no plan AFC east -- and I think there are others that are saying what do they bring in some really big trouble so he sir oh come on eleven and five. They'll be AFC's still -- I think Miami to be good. Good I think Miami to be good -- -- -- -- eight I think they can be good team I think they can be an above 500 team and what's a good team. 97 aren't so I think that began so yeah I -- -- 76 I think -- I think guys are really entry because he had a good team it's probably right. A ticket or not it. All right good football -- in that range I don't know exactly what they're gonna finish can be 88 could be nine and seven could be 1060. Due to the mid point of 97 is sort of the gas and I kind of like what Miami's don't -- to -- to me was much better than I thought it was going to be. I was expecting nothing OK he's nothing for going to out of nothing I got a whole division under 500 I don't think -- knowing. I mean the jets are just sort of an ugly 500 or were the bills or worse I get funny stories about the bills today. Get a -- funny story this is what's passing -- -- -- buffalo is too easy but this is so good to have funny stories -- give you quick funny story about the -- story at the calls their current. In most of this came from this is from a couple weeks ago but it's from pro football talk in most NFL stadiums which a modern seats are decent weather. The league's new bag policy represents an inconvenience for the sake of security not want to bring bags in the stadiums and but in buffalo. Longtime fans are worried about freezing their butts off literally seat cushions ball into the league's ban and for those and Ralph Wilson Stadium. That's a huge factor. Now the first person interviewed for this story Michael. Is a rat read people. Okay. What do you think what do you think that the scripture is for read people Buffalo Bills. I it's probably in this he's been off for a long time. Probably 20/20 five year season ticket holder probably in his there. Early or early in that fifty early to mid fifties yet. Think it's terrible -- 96 year old titles at -- where he -- what I -- It's all about and I think it's terrible that 96 year old bill's been -- Diebold the seeds are cold in the Cushing gives you some insulation I can't imagine them banning seat cushion that's the -- of the seeds that's my man great people up. Well I can't I get the ball you football game. On WA. They -- the world knows he must have -- -- -- the seat cushions are now prohibited because of terrorist concerns people responded exactly the way you'd expect. In 96 year old bills -- to respond oh jeepers he said. Am offered the inspections including the body scanning and the delay in getting into the stadium is worthwhile for safety but I think it's ridiculous to -- seat cushion so an area that's. That's what's passing for news in buffalo they know that I'm worried about who's playing quarterback for them the worried about whether or not they're going to literally freeze themselves to the seats. Because and allowed to work cushions and in Ralph Wilson Stadium. I asked you Brad you wanted to root for buffalo for guys like rate people. 96. That happened Watson had to watch them go to those Super Bowl every year year after year and lose. And they have been to the playoffs -- tend to have those iron branches accused fox know it's pretty quiet I'm not saying it's not -- -- -- that stadium it is Foxboro Stadium yet with an upper deck and it's even colder because it's in the awful. 61777979837. Joseph jumps -- It's are just -- Not much they just comment and so you guys that are -- Upper eighty support in support by Israel what receivers. During the Super Bowls. And yeah without a branch. Around it and -- predicted people. Back in the days but it like -- really involved in the talks but. On it has the article set about how to fall. I noted that it -- and cheap oh and they'll probably give them more and they'll probably bring -- -- -- and sort of -- -- it's sort quarterback running that sort of situation. It is similar to what with Jacksonville and do that -- Robinson. They sort of a weapon or quote. But this. Start focusing more on short that the only -- -- -- -- true wide receivers. There really go beat at lest they're sat by. Now. I don't want that job. You know look at their draft. And what -- Texas earlier why doesn't anyone mention Dobson from Marshall. You know you look at look at Dobson. -- you look at in Amendola who is not your traditional. Slot guy that's what he's been billed as a guy who can play inside and play outside. You look at some of their picks. I think they have been a short passing team and -- -- -- he -- throw more short passes that's what they've been doing the last couple years it. We. Two but they haven't really had a lot they've been talks he read the optimal work. It's more sure opened to purposes. They were and the offense Wes Welker Hewitt sort you guys go to person goes in short use and beat it opened slide. But now that he's gone and they've got into him until look Louis. How you played a full season without getting a concussion. It's a darkness saint yeah Eric dobbs and he. A few spectacular. Marshall but I don't know it. A lot of really cute and I -- -- -- Q3. Catches in the air by. To really know how coaches. Well no I -- -- approach for the rookies of course we don't know you don't know there but it but then you can use that argument you know not go round and round here did -- use that. You're all in all argument against yourself you don't know what you have so you might have something. You might actually have something pretty good too. And even mentioned voice the receiver. They took out of TCU's. Addressed. The issue at wide receiver. I think part of it was maybe a deep threat and he needed a guy. Like -- -- it's a voices can become that's been he's been compared to John and -- Bolden a guy. Who made probably will not help the production and crumpled. In his rookie year -- -- Bolton was off the charts as a rookie. But the guy who doesn't mind press coverage guy who. Feels like I got a defensive back draped on me about -- -- -- catch it. I like the rest of what I like to fight for a big physical possession has seemed so they haven't had two of those things in Alaska. It is trying to think back on some of the better the better offenses that the patriots have had over the years and when it. But what what combination of factors has given them success right. I guess the way I see their offense in my colleague -- -- -- understand this really well because all the year all year. Time spent inside the organization's top of these guys. It seems like it's built on and on mismatches right in the Euro was trying to getting this master trying to find a good match up that you can exploit any giving game in any given play. How you were better than them in one spot. So at the beginning I see it -- -- we got three wide receivers. You only have two good cornerbacks -- gonna go pick on -- or third quarterback over and over and over again because like I just to keep your nickel guy can't cover third well. -- wide receiver. As it involves beat the NFL all that right and and the nickel corner has become starters to starter I mean he's known now gotta have three got -- after your -- if you have three quarterbacks you're not able to cover most of the teams in the league so how do you find the next type of an advantage well for the patriots. It is seemed to be. The tight end position OK fine you might be able to handle our three our three wide receivers -- now you're planning for every other team out there that has three good wide receivers. What do we hit -- with two good tight ends are you gonna cover them. Right and I think to be the evolution of the patriot. Offense in the league has evolved their two including including the patriots. The patriots know who knows if this will show up. This year in the draft. But their second round pick Jamie Collins out of southern miss. A fast guy on me dreadful football team and I gave -- -- credit but. One of the fastest guys at the combine. And I think they've seen him as a guy who can cover. Those those tight end and who can get through the quarterback and the rest of the league evolved through it. What has evolved because. You don't just today. Automatically -- he's a free safety he's a strong safety your safeties. Have to cover. Think he's gonna have to be able to cover because the game is everybody is spreading out everybody is. Is throwing to receivers in throwing that tight -- and not novel by any stretch for fourteen to have. -- -- in order to. -- gets to football now the patriots had the advantage because both of their their guys were at the top of the league's top that they were just pass catching tight ends. They were dynamic pass catching tight -- so it's hard to find to -- those guys but if you look on most NFL rosters. Even that teams like buffalo. Nelson got. -- -- on that tied him in the moral or those guys and they're properly. It isn't surprising that appetite and it looks like a receiver is a big guy and despite the -- -- not a great blocker but. Good received I would wonder you're talking about the evolution of the team and where where they -- next I'll -- -- position is not gonna work for this year and haven't spent any time on it as far as I know but that's the fullback position. And they have all of all the of all the amount of attention that's been paid on tight ends. Fullbacks have gotten the shaft ran him half the teams out there barely use a -- back you see a ton of one back offense patriots over the years -- often just taken a defensive -- put him in the backfield when you really needed it. Is that a spot where going forward you could find values say hey. Season a really really good fullback and use him in place and to get some of the different matchups. That he used to be getting out of the tight end position just lets people looking for the good full. Or maybe it's one of those things where you have. Just combinations are you hopeful who who can do traditional fullback things plus. And it's -- finals just because generally. -- these these devastating -- back again running back to the radicals that are probable. And he always says. Pine I wouldn't be your apartment fullback in this guy's completely. Bought my new car. He's still great price it's always is the Lorenzo -- of the -- always a glorified linemen but you know what those guys welcome block like your traditional fullback. But as the receiving ability of Hillary sinners. Who was a fullback but not really right. So we have one of those guys who knows it if it. If that player didn't it wasn't part of the Bill Walsh offer and -- they really first started doing the West Coast offense under a -- is not what Tom Rothman -- Bosnia that guy who could run out there and and make a few blocks and even when the patriots started doing started doing what they're doing when Brady. In mark Edwards I mean he kind of built some of why he did that. Not thing that he was the -- -- I'm not journal Obama to the Tom optimum level but when I think of the -- -- -- and it's a rules I think of the -- being a at least semi instrumental part of their offense. Now -- give it zero. -- I think it if it's that -- and really athletic fast athletic guy playing fullback there may be impossible but who knows we never -- receipt. Tied into doing the things that they're doing now so maybe the next the next move is for the full back to come back. As a Renaissance guy Renaissance -- back into like elegant -- 61777. Kinds of 937. -- calls or just a segment Tim Hasselbeck will join us at 3 o'clock. I talk a lot of football to an ex alcoholic WE. Tim Hasselbeck will join us coming appeared fifteen minutes getting quarterback's perspective. I quarterbacks of course are always at the focus is you talk of football -- ten days away from the start of patriots training camp Michael I'll be out their course. A week from Friday in Foxborough. Tom Brady is still one of the top handful quarterbacks in the NFL. Probably one. You've probably got to say one he's number one I. Care. Pitch it -- preemptive strike. I'm addicted to text here. If -- say it in New England. And I can't say that -- -- -- thank you say whoever you are is the best because this is if we have this conversation. On the other side of the country. I think it was a comfort I think there's an Aaron Rodgers I think in general people are now -- Aaron -- in the middle of the country they say -- -- I think round I think generally around the country they're saying Aaron -- number -- sports nation got -- poll on this I don't know but I feel like Aaron -- sort of has the title right now. As best quarterback on the planet in terms of at the level the playing at right now I'm not the best commercials he could have -- it doesn't die -- are awesome they're significantly better than Peyton Manning's but right now I'm gonna put them at at two or three really. I agree with you Rogers at three really. I am operating cash and got to either have is is Aaron Rodgers better than Peyton Manning yes. He's better America I think he's better player with a better player and Peyton and the guys at this stage in his career -- -- ability to move around and Manning had a pretty good year after missing an entire season not knocking -- it's not a knock it Peyton Manning and I think Peyton Manning is also in the top five. Probably the top four and I I think I would have Aaron Rodgers out. I think -- I think he can have. -- Manning or you can take Manning output Rodgers in there any candidate Manning. -- three. If he's not to get victory Drew Brees falls back a little bit after last year meaning you wonder whether he's still in the that's super league category the Brady and Manning and and Aaron Rodgers or appear to be an acrobat files back and commitment you accuse. Really cannot compare to back events about one year -- binds all of them like I'm I'm totally bought in on the kids I've seen people have a perfect but it guarantees are -- About -- middle -- -- three good months to get the football to anybody can have. Three good mom -- and how I don't know kids get I think I like oh yeah I love Russell Wilson College tapper neck RG three is the one I probably have the most concerns about the only because his ability to stay healthy I'd like them all alike watch in the mall. But to see any of them. Whether it's Colin -- nick Russell Wilson. Cam -- even. Say any of -- RG three. Their top five quarterback right now I don't cook and and maybe I'll say it -- weeks six weeks happen. Based on one year -- I don't think they're put were they don't put him in the top five based on the -- as well I think they're for real. I think -- I think their top fifteen and moving in the positive direction. As opposed to the other way and I think in a couple years as Brady gets older declines as Manning eventually is out of the league get as breeze is start to get older as well. I think is next group is gonna take over the mantle I think we don't have and they were having now is going to be. AE lock Wilson tapper nick type of the debate in in in short order -- -- the criteria is going to be higher on the list of these topic Bryant. And -- not -- he is going to be riot and jail early ranked you know going to be good quarterback all I'm doing is okay he's asked all right. A great quarterback but we have we've mentioned the old money. -- -- -- -- We haven't mentioned -- tickets to what the next generation particularly. Mr. governments and Eli Manning we still haven't mentioned. Ben Roethlisberger. We haven't mentioned Matt Ryan needs are very good quarterbacks. Who haven't even cracked the top five but I would take those three and the Super Bowl winning quarterback on -- of yet but Joseph Flacco. Document the first three guys limits and that the -- that the new -- are ready to take over for. -- I'm not convinced that RG three is better right now -- You're looking at a for 2013. I was -- really talking much more. 2013 or 2014 and beyond saying that I think that these guys are going to get there is certainly when I was talking about Ryan ten -- I was talking about next year he's a lot of guys to try leapfrogging sort of the other guys but. But I think they're going to get there I do believe in them I believe that they are continuing to get better and that of and that they have this added element to their game which is eventually going to put them over the top 617779. 7937. -- in Rhode -- time. Hey -- -- At my age you -- I got to believe it. And it's and so outrage now all because I believe it's and so they seek. Like what you -- an outward from -- talk about there radio. Or maybe. I can and so possibly open because I hear you are able. But I don't want to my -- laws and are doubly closed but I want we've actually been or at BQ buried. Actor about off all your arm. -- I used to be a better answer. I guess gamers up Matta by that bit and I probably -- it Matta probably have slipped into it happens happens in the best of us have probably -- But what I wanted to talk our odds -- child resides today Andrew Luck is more. Party used to and -- in the young -- On Tom Brady is chew -- Aaron Rodgers now quarterback -- make all the -- argue that Jerry Rogers. On but as again in miniature. All the -- I shall leave great life. On at around the nation I got to leave the nation. And I hate when a talker I'm not Smart friend that we. Believe we're pretty darn good or ghost on our writers is an old Brady and I don't think that that autonomy. That is because it just saved because of is it is it is a regular season as a post season what does. I just -- our Aaron Rodgers makes a lot of these you know unbelievable -- I but I also believe breach the putrid stay away from. Those percentage little Google the more article actually script ladies or. You know although it's -- -- to play and that's why. I think it's really just the added ability to move around the football and I I think well that the commonly held belief on Aaron Rodgers is. He can do pretty much everything that that that the stepped back drop back passers can do. Any anywhere in the play as well that can move around he can run he can throw on the run he's got a huge armament is arm is every bit as big as all the other a top guys. -- he can move around better than anyone else on that list I think that's why. He's sort of ahead of the pack when people beat down on appeared if you're down on Tom Brady what you beat down on him because of what what he's done in the post season yes -- and they get it right if you're down on Tom -- violate coming in at number two. Isn't really being down on tyra grant and not put your regular during nitpick what if you want those people who says or Aaron Rodgers is better and Tom Brady. And the post season as part of it. You're saying Tom Brady is not the in the same kind of clutch performer that he once was out of Iran Pakistan and post season. I mean that's is it that's it no maybe it hasn't happened at a with the policies and maybe just like the way. Aaron Rodgers. Runs his offense maybe like the way he runs and -- you don't see Tom Brady running anymore and that's it but if you're gonna factory and performance. You look at -- both of these guys lately have been so great the polls in John's -- Rhode Island -- You don't has done. A collar job and you know Brady Rodgers and he -- back to 2000. You know ABC. And they got. Took in the Super Bowl or immobility really shows -- situation -- talk deeper and little greedy and a majority. Of he's slightly turned into that. You know that bullet in the market worried crumbles as pressure you know what does that little and -- we ordered destruction. Mobility the -- these. You know. First restaurant is he's a mobile I wouldn't say he is Bledsoe back there because that things up and -- With our respective Drew Bledsoe was a good NFL quarterback he's pretty mobile in the pocket yet he has an innate feel that Dan -- -- feel like how to handle himself -- -- in the -- not fat but we've got a runner when when I think back about the beginnings of Tom Brady sort of coming into his own. One of the things I remember as a young -- younger football -- just out of college at that time was thinking. He changed the game a little bit by refusing to throw interceptions right. -- pat played breaks down around them rather than try to force the ball in a lot Brett Favre as he got older. -- just throw the ball he's really good at that right to same -- I don't wanna take a negative play I'm happy to throw the ball when you're an act you don't even have to say it was who's Brett Favre like you know -- -- -- It was like everybody benefit they -- Richard blessed that's left and right. Bledsoe it is if you wanna say he's a big guy who hasn't run that well yes he has like group let's open in terms of its decision making even when he's not running well right. He still makes better decisions but I think but I think here's why people are thrown Aaron Rodgers ahead of him because Aaron Rodgers can look at that same play. Were everything breaks down and not need to just throw a ball throw the ball like he doesn't need to force it in. A lot bled so far that -- he doesn't need to throw away a -- Brady and some others. He could turn around and either run down the field. Or. And I think that's why Aaron you know -- -- -- aspect ESPN analyst. You'll join us coming up here in just a moment Brady Rodgers where the patriots -- -- -- coming up salt and holly W --
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Shawn Thornton joined the show fresh off his big night at MSG and talked about his recent goal scoring prowess. Shawn said that no matter who his line mates are he is always going to be a fourth liner.
Kirk Minihane answered any and all questions from the listeners and John and Gerry.
The New York Post's Joel Sherman joined the show with his thoughts on jacoby Ellsbury's signing with the Yankees. He said that if it were up to him he would have given the money to Robinson Cano over Ellsbury.
The top stories of the day as recounted by Kirk Minihane. They discussed how Ron Burgundy has officially jumped the shark and played sound of him on Dan Patrick.
Peter King joins Mut and Merloni to go across the NFL and address the latest news. He discusses Kubiak's firing, Tomlin's fine, and Dennard's possible suspension.
Brick makes his weekly appearance on Mut and Merloni and discusses the Bruins loss to Montreal and the hit on Johnny Boychuck.
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We check in with Herm Edwards on the Pats, Stevan Ridley, and a great many things around the NFL.
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Alex joins the show and gives his thoughts on the Jacoby Ellsbury deal, and what prospects the Red Sox have to fill the hole left in the lineup, or trade pieces to get a player who can fill the void.
John talks to Rob and gets his thoughts on the Yankees signing Jacoby Ellsbury, the Red Sox signing AJ Pierzynski, and Jarrod Saltalamacchia signing with Miami.
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